Dinnie Stones: IHGF Scottish Stones of Strength World Challenge

[Peter Martin]

Peter -

Truth is, evidently Francis nicely brought an IronMind banner with him to Scotland, and before you mouth off about the IronMind News or MILO again, get your story straight or people will think that instead of having stones on your mind, you have rocks in your head.

Hardly wrong Randall, your news is not accurate so you will just have to live with being wrong on this occasion and now that I have your attention - could you explain how I supposedly derailed a competition that has went ahead.? I would also love to know who the identity of the bogey man that they all feared turning up to put a stop to it and hence the lies on this Forum about the date of the event. I did intend going but you know full well by my email the reasons for wanting to attend which had nothing to do with stone lifting but other matters, perhaps more important. A chance missed I would say. Apologies about the banner comment..

[Randall Strossen]

Peter: Wrong Again

Randall, There is no hornets nest. It is quite clearly a divide between those that know and those that think they know but really don't have a clue. With all due respect to the IHGF (in its current guise) perhaps they should be advised that Highland Games culture and Traditional stone lifting culture are two COMPLETELY different entities. Having knowledge of or being a great competitor at the heavy events does not mean that you are then blessed with a thorough knowledge and understanding of stone lifting culture, it comes at a price and I am unaware of anything that messrs Brebner and Vierra, other than having lifted the odd stone on the A93 corridor, have actually contributed to the furtherment of Scottish stone lifting. Stone lifting is not a mix of both the Inver and Dinnie Steens, some but not all, think that all you do is visit Scotland, lift these stones and then go home as instant experts......it is a Dinniecentric view and completely wrong. There is a far bigger cultural picture and the IHGF will, and believe me in this, they will make a mockery of it. They will no doubt be ably supported by your good self as there is an Ironmind Ad in the photo so I find it quite surprising that you would sponsor or support such an event and be completely ignorant in what is actually going to take place. Ironmind News states that it is FAST, ACCURATE AND OBJECTIVE...........not in this one it isn't......well off mark and in any case, I count seven o/h Inver lifts or does it really matter, lets take any number. On stone lifting, there is more chance of HBO signing up this crew to write a fantasy called A Game of Stones - Two MILO articles and this mince certainly proves suitability for purpose. Pure fantasy.

Peter -

Truth is, evidently Francis nicely brought an IronMind banner with him to Scotland, and before you mouth off about the IronMind News or MILO again, get your story straight or people will think that instead of having stones on your mind, you have rocks in your head.

[Peter Martin]

Travis, I'm not surprised that the locals had no knowledge about the harness. I have two local newspaper(Missouri) articles of the time where Bangert waxes lyrically about his strength, first person to walk the stones etc but cleverly fails to mention how he did it exactly. He leaves the firm impression that he walked whilst holding both stones in what is considered the proper manner. He goes on at length about a bet he had with the Lord Mayor of Aberdeen, winning a bottle of whiskey etc etc but completely ignorant that in Scotland we do not have a Lord Mayor on any Mayor for that matter......he have Provosts.....Liars will always be caught out somehow. I will email the articles if you wish.

[Peter Martin]

A Game of Stones

Bill -

I, too, cringed when I saw the lifting straps and really wish they had not been used, but you know what a hornet's nest that one is.

Is Bill Bankert the guy who "lifted" and "carried" the Dinnie Stones by using a shoulder harness?

Randall, There is no hornets nest. It is quite clearly a divide between those that know and those that think they know but really don't have a clue. With all due respect to the IHGF (in its current guise) perhaps they should be advised that Highland Games culture and Traditional stone lifting culture are two COMPLETELY different entities. Having knowledge of or being a great competitor at the heavy events does not mean that you are then blessed with a thorough knowledge and understanding of stone lifting culture, it comes at a price and I am unaware of anything that messrs Brebner and Vierra, other than having lifted the odd stone on the A93 corridor, have actually contributed to the furtherment of Scottish stone lifting. Stone lifting is not a mix of both the Inver and Dinnie Steens, some but not all, think that all you do is visit Scotland, lift these stones and then go home as instant experts......it is a Dinniecentric view and completely wrong. There is a far bigger cultural picture and the IHGF will, and believe me in this, they will make a mockery of it. They will no doubt be ably supported by your good self as there is an Ironmind Ad in the photo so I find it quite surprising that you would sponsor or support such an event and be completely ignorant in what is actually going to take place. Ironmind News states that it is FAST, ACCURATE AND OBJECTIVE...........not in this one it isn't......well off mark and in any case, I count seven o/h Inver lifts or does it really matter, lets take any number. On stone lifting, there is more chance of HBO signing up this crew to write a fantasy called A Game of Stones - Two MILO articles and this mince certainly proves suitability for purpose. Pure fantasy.

[Bill Crawford]

No doubt the young man who carried the Dinnies with the straps is strong and won the competition. Great for him. He did not however equal Dinnie's feat. History may have been made for a different reason but not for equaling Donald Dinnie in any way.

The Dinnies should be lifted bare handed. No straps. That is how Dinnie would have lifted them. I am not interested in regulations, PED testing or whatever. But just do the basics. Bare hand lift the stones.

Before Jack Shanks showed everyone that the Dinnies could be lifted in the early 70's there were some who had lifted them with straps. But those lifts were not recognized.

Bill Bankert built a contraption in which he placed the Dinnies on a wooden pallet and had shoulder harnesses attached to the pallet. He then held the rings but again, the stones were lifted with the pallet and a leather harness. There is a Dinnie website (or there used to be, I need to check) with a picture on the site just to show the contraption with Bankert in with the stones. Being fair, lifting the stones with straps is in a different league than the contraption that Bankert made.

Apples and oranges. Anyone who has lifted the Dinnies will tell you, the grip is the great limiting factor. Also, to lift them side to side, which I have, the large stone gets caught on your leg on the way up. That pulls it from your hand. With straps you can overcome that impediment.

To me this is not controversial, it is black and white.

Bill

[Travis Willingham]

[Randall Strossen]

The lifter did use straps. That to me is not even a legitimate lift of the stones. Did Dinnie use straps. No. Is this what we have come to? Sure the lifter is a strong guy. But really?

Do you guys know who Bill Bankert is? But I forgot, this is 2013 and we can revise history to fit our needs.

Bill

Bill -

I, too, cringed when I saw the lifting straps and really wish they had not been used, but you know what a hornet's nest that one is.

Is Bill Bankert the guy who "lifted" and "carried" the Dinnie Stones by using a shoulder harness?

[Peter Martin]

The lifter did use straps. That to me is not even a legitimate lift of the stones. Did Dinnie use straps. No. Is this what we have come to? Sure the lifter is a strong guy. But really?

Do you guys know who Bill Bankert is? But I forgot, this is 2013 and we can revise history to fit our needs.

Bill

Bill, I still think it is a tremendous feat of strength but it in no way, regardless how some try to perceive it, is it a bettering of the Dinnies feat of strength. And by the way, the ghost of Bangert still lives.......quite obvious in the accepted practice by some but not all to change practice and culture to make things fit. I can't wait to see it all on TV..........I guess that there is more chance of this thread turning into a mire rather than my three simple questions beings answered.Bridge?, Weight? Drugs?...........Oh, and yes.....I thought I had derailed this event? ............I knew otherwise.

[Bill Crawford]

The lifter did use straps. That to me is not even a legitimate lift of the stones. Did Dinnie use straps. No. Is this what we have come to? Sure the lifter is a strong guy. But really?

Do you guys know who Bill Bankert is? But I forgot, this is 2013 and we can revise history to fit our needs.

Bill

[Peter Martin]

It ain't over till the fat lady sings

Firstly, I would like to applaud a tremendous feat of strength because it is. Secondly, The lift and walk of the Dinnie Steens is the replication of a feat of strength rather than in any way representative of traditional stone lifting and as this was an attempt to replicate that feat, I would expect the following to have been put in place - 1. Dinnie walked the breadth of the bridge and back requiring an obvious turn.......the bridge should have been used 2. Were the steens weighed before this event? It would be interesting for ALL to known what the current weight of the steens are. 3. Were straps used? 4. And very important.......As far as I am aware, Dinnie was not a user of PED's based on the assumption that they weren't around at the time, so to fully replicate......was there drug testing? And finally, is this an attempt by the IHGF to extend their world domination to stone lifting? Again, this is a tremendous feat of strength but it does stand alone........at least it is none of this lifting for "reps" nonsense created, marketed and believed by the ignorant.

[Randall Strossen]

http://www.ironmind.com

http://www.ironmind.com/ironmind/opencms/Articles/2013/Jun/IHGF_Scottish_Stones_of_Strength_World_Challenge-Dinnie_Stones_Go_for_a_Walk.html