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Dead lifts and the Highland Games

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  • Dead lifts and the Highland Games

    Okay, so either my form is getting bad or my back is getting weak. I keep straining/tweeking my back when I do heavy deadl lifts. I am not sure where the problem is, but I am definately not happy. My question is this:

    If I am already doing power cleans and squats what exercise should I substitute for the dead lift? What is another essential lift I am missing for highland games training? Is it the snatch or something else?

    I guess that was more than "a" question. Help me out here you muscle guru strength geniuses!!!

    To get an idea of my routine go check out my blog:
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  • #2
    Maybe your hammies are tight? This would force hips higher and you would pull more with hipsback and drive less with legs. Try deads out of a squat rack, that is start at the top and lower down. Also, stretch the hammies

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    • #3
      ok...I am sure my hammies were probably tight on the last day I did deads. I was doing cleans first usually in the routine, but lacked the strength to really give it to the deads after. Then I switched and did deads first and busted my back up...I have a feeling that the cold "Cave of Strength" and the lack of good warm up would be the cause in the kinetic chain break down.

      What's a good substitute or on lift I might be missing?
      Check out my blog and leave your comments:
      http://worldsstrongestscientist.blogspot.com

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      • #4
        I was talking about this with Mike Pockoski on Saturday - neither of us have ever done heavy deadlifts, and don't think you need them for throwing. Squats, cleans/snatches and presses are all you really need.
        And lots of throwing!

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        • #5
          IMO to much low back work in your workout week.
          I would cycle deadlifts and power cleans on separete cycles.
          I have only been doing HG for a couple years and deadlifting throughout that time on different cycles.
          I don't feel that have helped me as much as I had liked in the games.
          I think they train me to be to slow and grindy.They help absolute strength but don't do much for my speed and explosiveness.I am going to give a cycle of speed deadlifts a try and see how that works.
          I agree with Dave and was also told by Ryan Veirra at a clinic that to get better at throwing you have to throw and not to depend on so much lifting to make Your throws better.
          I do agree though you need some basic strength behind you.

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          • #6
            Thanks guys. I know deads are slow I just needed to hear it from someone else. I will phase them out of my workout and focus more on the cleans and snatches. I just started really working my presses as well(like building an actual program and testing max), so I must be on the right track. And today was the last game of my football coaching season, so I will take to the field next week and start throwing.

            I guess I started doing deads with visions of grandeur of being a powerlifter. I found out I don't have the back for it.
            Check out my blog and leave your comments:
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            • #7
              ...also can someone explain "speed deadlifts" to me?
              Check out my blog and leave your comments:
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              • #8
                Speed deadlifts are just fast as you can pull DLs with good form.
                Usually done with 50 to 60% of 1 rep max.
                The westside guys do something like 8 sets of 2 reps with 45 to60 seconds rest between sets.
                I would do a rep stand up reset then the next.
                This isn't written in stone but the idea is to pull fast to train for speed.

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                • #9
                  You can try partial movements

                  You can try partial movements e.g. cycling halting deadlifts (from floor to above the knees) and rack pulls (from below the knees to lockout), to increase your deadlift strength without having to stress your back with full-range deadlifts, thus helping you to better recover from them.
                  I wouldn't drop them from your routine completely, as they help you get stronger in the clean and snatch.
                  I agree with the other recommendations here however, that if the deadlift strength does not increase your throws, maybe maintaining your current deadlift strength is sufficient.

                  I'm still working on bringing up my base strength, so my advice is from people I know who were using the above mentioned tweaks successfully themselves.

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                  • #10
                    Thanks for all the input guys! I have decided to keep the deads in the program for now. I am really watching my weights and such though. I will be doing more snatch as well. I currently work a good routine on 65% for 5x5 and 68% for 3x5. That's the one I feel works my back and hams without injury...which I have avoided recently.
                    Check out my blog and leave your comments:
                    http://worldsstrongestscientist.blogspot.com

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